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	<title>Comments on: United Order vs Consecration</title>
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	<description>Stuff they don't talk about in Sunday School</description>
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		<title>By: Mormon Heretic &#187; Sister Wives are Socialist</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-13039</link>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic &#187; Sister Wives are Socialist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 20:50:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] like free markets, because free markets often gouge individuals. As I outlined in my post on Consecration vs United Order, the early polygamy persecutions were as much about forcing free markets onto the Mormons as it was [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] like free markets, because free markets often gouge individuals. As I outlined in my post on Consecration vs United Order, the early polygamy persecutions were as much about forcing free markets onto the Mormons as it was [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Sister Wives are Socialist &#124; Wheat and Tares</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-13038</link>
		<dc:creator>Sister Wives are Socialist &#124; Wheat and Tares</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2011 17:57:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=701#comment-13038</guid>
		<description>[...] like free markets, because free markets often gouge individuals.  As I outlined in my post on Consecration vs United Order, the early polygamy persecutions were as much about forcing free markets onto the Mormons as it was [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] like free markets, because free markets often gouge individuals.  As I outlined in my post on Consecration vs United Order, the early polygamy persecutions were as much about forcing free markets onto the Mormons as it was [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mormon Heretic &#187; The Moral Panic Causes Trouble in Zion</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-6911</link>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic &#187; The Moral Panic Causes Trouble in Zion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jul 2010 02:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=701#comment-6911</guid>
		<description>[...] Oliver Cowdery, and WW Phelps are excommunicated.  Many of these dissenters opposed living the Law of Consecration.  (As I mentioned in my previous post on consecration, it won&#8217;t work unless all members of [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Oliver Cowdery, and WW Phelps are excommunicated.  Many of these dissenters opposed living the Law of Consecration.  (As I mentioned in my previous post on consecration, it won&#8217;t work unless all members of [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mormon Heretic</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-4813</link>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 04:08:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=701#comment-4813</guid>
		<description>LDS in Texas,

Thanks for posting this.  While you&#039;re welcome to email me at mormon heretic at gmail dot com, I think this is a perfect place for the link.  I listened to only the first 5 minutes, but judging from that, I may have to write my own transcript of his talk.  It sounds very interesting, and I definitely want to take time to listen to the whole thing.  It could be a future post!  Thanks.  (And I don&#039;t mind resurrecting old topics either, especially if you have something valuable to add such as this link.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LDS in Texas,</p>
<p>Thanks for posting this.  While you&#8217;re welcome to email me at mormon heretic at gmail dot com, I think this is a perfect place for the link.  I listened to only the first 5 minutes, but judging from that, I may have to write my own transcript of his talk.  It sounds very interesting, and I definitely want to take time to listen to the whole thing.  It could be a future post!  Thanks.  (And I don&#8217;t mind resurrecting old topics either, especially if you have something valuable to add such as this link.)</p>
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		<title>By: LDS in Texas</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-4797</link>
		<dc:creator>LDS in Texas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 06:39:13 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>MH, it wasn&#039;t my intention tonight to publicly drum up on old subject, but I couldn&#039;t find a way to message you directly.  So, for what it&#039;s worth, all can enjoy (or not).

On the subject of consecration (again, one of my favorites), I offer a link to a talk from the 2008 Sperry Symposium.  Not sure if you&#039;ve seen this before.  It could have just as well been entitled &quot;The Law of Consecration for the 21st Century&quot; and takes the same approach as I have, although more thoroughly and eloquently.  Thought you might enjoy.

http://www.byub.org/talks/Talk.aspx?id=3416</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MH, it wasn&#8217;t my intention tonight to publicly drum up on old subject, but I couldn&#8217;t find a way to message you directly.  So, for what it&#8217;s worth, all can enjoy (or not).</p>
<p>On the subject of consecration (again, one of my favorites), I offer a link to a talk from the 2008 Sperry Symposium.  Not sure if you&#8217;ve seen this before.  It could have just as well been entitled &#8220;The Law of Consecration for the 21st Century&#8221; and takes the same approach as I have, although more thoroughly and eloquently.  Thought you might enjoy.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.byub.org/talks/Talk.aspx?id=3416" rel="nofollow">http://www.byub.org/talks/Talk.aspx?id=3416</a></p>
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		<title>By: LDS in Texas</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-3599</link>
		<dc:creator>LDS in Texas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Sep 2009 17:55:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=701#comment-3599</guid>
		<description>Great question, FireTag, and one we must all ask ourselves if we intend to fulfill our covenant.  Of course, the answer is individual and provided by the Holy Spirit.

Therein lies the difficulty in looking around and surmising that no one is living it today.  This is further complicated by the fact that even in a Zionist / United Order society, all members wouldn&#039;t have the same stuff or even live at the same level of &quot;luxury&quot; (for lack of a better term).  Individual adaptation applies based on varying needs, wants, personal taste, etc.  That last part has a good portion of my opinion in it, but it is based on all that I have read on the subject.  Even in a United Order situation, I wouldn&#039;t care that my neighbor had a boat because I&#039;m not really that into them anyway...but I&#039;m sure I&#039;d be able to borrow it as often as I wanted. : )

...Again, the Law of Consecration goes much deeper than the temporal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great question, FireTag, and one we must all ask ourselves if we intend to fulfill our covenant.  Of course, the answer is individual and provided by the Holy Spirit.</p>
<p>Therein lies the difficulty in looking around and surmising that no one is living it today.  This is further complicated by the fact that even in a Zionist / United Order society, all members wouldn&#8217;t have the same stuff or even live at the same level of &#8220;luxury&#8221; (for lack of a better term).  Individual adaptation applies based on varying needs, wants, personal taste, etc.  That last part has a good portion of my opinion in it, but it is based on all that I have read on the subject.  Even in a United Order situation, I wouldn&#8217;t care that my neighbor had a boat because I&#8217;m not really that into them anyway&#8230;but I&#8217;m sure I&#8217;d be able to borrow it as often as I wanted. : )</p>
<p>&#8230;Again, the Law of Consecration goes much deeper than the temporal.</p>
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		<title>By: Mormon Heretic &#187; Successors of Consecration: Tithing and Fast Offerings</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-3535</link>
		<dc:creator>Mormon Heretic &#187; Successors of Consecration: Tithing and Fast Offerings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Sep 2009 05:09:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=701#comment-3535</guid>
		<description>[...] may want to review Part 1 and Part 2 of my consecration series as [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] may want to review Part 1 and Part 2 of my consecration series as [...]</p>
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		<title>By: FireTag</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-3518</link>
		<dc:creator>FireTag</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Sep 2009 23:47:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=701#comment-3518</guid>
		<description>I see Alex more, but there is really a little boy&#039;s joy to him and an excitement when he scores that I was trying to capture as an example: I&#039;d like to have the attitude where every gift I give, every person I help, is so much of a high that I can&#039;t wait to do it again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see Alex more, but there is really a little boy&#8217;s joy to him and an excitement when he scores that I was trying to capture as an example: I&#8217;d like to have the attitude where every gift I give, every person I help, is so much of a high that I can&#8217;t wait to do it again.</p>
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		<title>By: MH</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-3516</link>
		<dc:creator>MH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Sep 2009 17:00:14 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>LDS in Texas, I am glad you have broken out of your &quot;lurker&quot; status, and I welcome your comments.  When I look at the Law of Consecration as (paraphrasing) &quot;giving all our time, talents, and energies which we have received or may receive in the future to the church&quot;, I can&#039;t think of a single person I know who does this, yet the pioneers did.  I think that people like Mother Teresa live the Law of Consecration better than most LDS do.

I get your point that we don&#039;t need a formal program to live the law of consecration, but in reality, I think without a formal program, nobody would do it.  Even Mother Teresa took a vow of poverty as part of a Catholic Order of Nuns, which is a formal program.  Every once in a while you will hear about someone who gives out $100 bills in a secret Santa way--I suppose this could be considered a form of consecration, but this is a rare exception, and only happens to a person late in life--it&#039;s rarely a lifelong way of life to live this way.

FireTag, I would like to get into King Benjamin&#039;s frame of mind about giving--that would be pretty cool.  (And I would have picked Mario Lemieux or Sidney Crosby over Alex Ovechkin--but you&#039;re probably picking a local hockey star over a national one...)  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LDS in Texas, I am glad you have broken out of your &#8220;lurker&#8221; status, and I welcome your comments.  When I look at the Law of Consecration as (paraphrasing) &#8220;giving all our time, talents, and energies which we have received or may receive in the future to the church&#8221;, I can&#8217;t think of a single person I know who does this, yet the pioneers did.  I think that people like Mother Teresa live the Law of Consecration better than most LDS do.</p>
<p>I get your point that we don&#8217;t need a formal program to live the law of consecration, but in reality, I think without a formal program, nobody would do it.  Even Mother Teresa took a vow of poverty as part of a Catholic Order of Nuns, which is a formal program.  Every once in a while you will hear about someone who gives out $100 bills in a secret Santa way&#8211;I suppose this could be considered a form of consecration, but this is a rare exception, and only happens to a person late in life&#8211;it&#8217;s rarely a lifelong way of life to live this way.</p>
<p>FireTag, I would like to get into King Benjamin&#8217;s frame of mind about giving&#8211;that would be pretty cool.  (And I would have picked Mario Lemieux or Sidney Crosby over Alex Ovechkin&#8211;but you&#8217;re probably picking a local hockey star over a national one&#8230;)  <img src='http://www.mormonheretic.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: FireTag</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/09/06/united-order-vs-consecration/comment-page-1/#comment-3512</link>
		<dc:creator>FireTag</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Sep 2009 04:07:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=701#comment-3512</guid>
		<description>I often have the business channel on in the background while I work. I heard one commentator ask plaintively -- and I have felt the same way at times -- &quot;How much is it fair to ask me to give?&quot;

I want to get to the point where I always feel, &quot;How much do I get to give?&quot; and mean it with the kind of joy Alex Ovechkin would show if you asked him how many goals he got to score. (hockey note to MH and FD!)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I often have the business channel on in the background while I work. I heard one commentator ask plaintively &#8212; and I have felt the same way at times &#8212; &#8220;How much is it fair to ask me to give?&#8221;</p>
<p>I want to get to the point where I always feel, &#8220;How much do I get to give?&#8221; and mean it with the kind of joy Alex Ovechkin would show if you asked him how many goals he got to score. (hockey note to MH and FD!)</p>
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