Comments on: Sidney & Joseph – A Strained Friendship – Part 4 http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/ Stuff they don't talk about in Sunday School Wed, 08 Feb 2012 14:23:56 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.3 By: Interesting Presentations at Weber State | Wheat and Tares http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-12466 Interesting Presentations at Weber State | Wheat and Tares Thu, 11 Aug 2011 05:46:31 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-12466 [...] I asked about an unusual issue with Emma Smith. Quoting from my previous post, Some of the footnotes are very interesting on this subject. Footnote 26 on page 305 quotes an 1844 [...] [...] I asked about an unusual issue with Emma Smith. Quoting from my previous post, Some of the footnotes are very interesting on this subject. Footnote 26 on page 305 quotes an 1844 [...]

]]> By: Mormon Heretic » Interesting Presentations at Weber State http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-12399 Mormon Heretic » Interesting Presentations at Weber State Mon, 08 Aug 2011 04:44:14 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-12399 [...] I asked about an unusual issue with Emma Smith. Quoting from my previous post, Some of the footnotes are very interesting on this subject. Footnote 26 on page 305 quotes an 1844 [...] [...] I asked about an unusual issue with Emma Smith. Quoting from my previous post, Some of the footnotes are very interesting on this subject. Footnote 26 on page 305 quotes an 1844 [...]

]]> By: Mormon Heretic » Multiple Sealings for Women http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-12163 Mormon Heretic » Multiple Sealings for Women Sun, 24 Jul 2011 22:48:16 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-12163 [...] subject of polygamy was quite controversial with Emma.  in a previous post, Richard Van Wagoner noted the issue of polygamy left Joseph and Emma’s marriage hanging by a [...] [...] subject of polygamy was quite controversial with Emma.  in a previous post, Richard Van Wagoner noted the issue of polygamy left Joseph and Emma’s marriage hanging by a [...]

]]> By: Mormon Heretic http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-10919 Mormon Heretic Sat, 02 Apr 2011 20:31:28 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-10919 Richard, I appreciate your comment. Have you had a chance to read Richard Van Wagoner's book on Sidney Rigdon? I think it is the best biography on Rigdon out there. See http://astore.amazon.com/mormhere-20/detail/156085197X Richard, I appreciate your comment. Have you had a chance to read Richard Van Wagoner’s book on Sidney Rigdon? I think it is the best biography on Rigdon out there. See http://astore.amazon.com/mormhere-20/detail/156085197X

]]> By: Richard Weeden http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-10917 Richard Weeden Sat, 02 Apr 2011 19:08:15 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-10917 I hope that there can be further comments and consideration regarding Sidney Rigdon's post Nauvoo conduct and activities concerning the real reasons for his not attending his excommunications trial. I believe that he was a good and faith servant to Joseph Smith JR. and his family. I further believe that Rigdon "turned his back and dusted off his coat" because his council and views were recognized to be unacceptable to Brigham Young's leadership and social practices. Young's leadership success was pragmatical and physical by escaping with his followers to the vast emptiness of Utah where his way was the only communal way. Rigdon only wanted to assume "temporary" guardianship via intellectual insight and moral training to the Prophet's son as Alexander's tutorially received before assumming his historic leadership role. Rigdon was the man of classic humanities absent the attributes of Young's moral pursuits. Rigdon sought THE SECOND COMING while Young sought THE WILD WILD WEST. The real question is not "who presummingly won the game" but how you leave the "field of life" Rigdon contributions to society's understaining of life disappointments did not end with his excommunication and so he further suffered and did, in good faith, pursued further the path of rightestness in preparing his flock for THE SECOND COMING and thus rejoining with the PROPHET in Heaven. This period of Rigdon's life is a great story that has never been fully documented and appreciated. I hope that there can be further comments and consideration regarding Sidney Rigdon’s post Nauvoo conduct and activities concerning the real reasons for his not attending his excommunications trial. I believe that he was a good and faith servant to Joseph Smith JR. and his family. I further believe that Rigdon “turned his back and dusted off his coat” because his council and views were recognized to be unacceptable to Brigham Young’s leadership and social practices. Young’s leadership success was pragmatical and physical by escaping with his followers to the vast emptiness of Utah where his way was the only communal way. Rigdon only wanted to assume “temporary” guardianship via intellectual insight and moral training to the Prophet’s son as Alexander’s tutorially received before assumming his historic leadership role. Rigdon was the man of classic humanities absent the attributes of Young’s moral pursuits. Rigdon sought THE SECOND COMING while Young sought THE WILD WILD WEST. The real question is not “who presummingly won the game” but how you leave the “field of life” Rigdon contributions to society’s understaining of life disappointments did not end with his excommunication and so he further suffered and did, in good faith, pursued further the path of rightestness in preparing his flock for THE SECOND COMING and thus rejoining with the PROPHET in Heaven. This period of Rigdon’s life is a great story that has never been fully documented and appreciated.

]]> By: Mormon Heretic http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-1967 Mormon Heretic Wed, 22 Apr 2009 05:16:28 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-1967 James, Go ahead and post it on your blog. It is kind of off-topic here, but very on topic for your blog. Are you sure you want to go down this road? I have plenty of statements from world-renown scholars, and would be willing to post multiple statements from scholars with PhD next to their name affirming that Joseph had multiple wives. I am aware that all of my sources quote RLDS historians affirming the fact that Joseph had multiple wives. If you prefer RLDS scholars, I would even limit my sources to RLDS-only. James, I am not trying to tear down your faith. I really respect CoC members such as yourself. My main purpose is to post accurate, historical information, regardless of whether it is "church-approved." I know many people struggle when the stories they were told as children turn out to be untrue, or half-true. Many people become disillusioned, and want to leave the church. My site is to talk about tough issues, and remain faithful. I know you are CoC (RLDS), and I want you to stay active CoC, but I want you to have accurate information if that is your desire. Not all people have that desire. My wife and mother-in-law prefer to keep their blissful ignorance, and I fully respect that. But if you want to learn hard facts about Joseph Smith, this is a place to learn without destroying faith. I believe Joseph was a prophet of God, and I also believe that he was fallible and made mistakes. Polygamy was a big mistake, and anyone who blames the whole episode on Brigham Young (such as yourself) is mistaken. James,

Go ahead and post it on your blog. It is kind of off-topic here, but very on topic for your blog.

Are you sure you want to go down this road? I have plenty of statements from world-renown scholars, and would be willing to post multiple statements from scholars with PhD next to their name affirming that Joseph had multiple wives. I am aware that all of my sources quote RLDS historians affirming the fact that Joseph had multiple wives. If you prefer RLDS scholars, I would even limit my sources to RLDS-only.

James, I am not trying to tear down your faith. I really respect CoC members such as yourself. My main purpose is to post accurate, historical information, regardless of whether it is “church-approved.”

I know many people struggle when the stories they were told as children turn out to be untrue, or half-true. Many people become disillusioned, and want to leave the church. My site is to talk about tough issues, and remain faithful. I know you are CoC (RLDS), and I want you to stay active CoC, but I want you to have accurate information if that is your desire.

Not all people have that desire. My wife and mother-in-law prefer to keep their blissful ignorance, and I fully respect that. But if you want to learn hard facts about Joseph Smith, this is a place to learn without destroying faith. I believe Joseph was a prophet of God, and I also believe that he was fallible and made mistakes. Polygamy was a big mistake, and anyone who blames the whole episode on Brigham Young (such as yourself) is mistaken.

]]> By: James Brian Marshall http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-1966 James Brian Marshall Wed, 22 Apr 2009 04:55:18 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-1966 MH, Correction, Joseph Smith only had one wife. LDS history, RLDS history, as well as the testimonies of thousands of whitnesses testify to this fact. Would you believe the words of a child molester? Or trust the words of a confirmed criminal? Would you let a murderer preach to you about Christ after he'd just killed somone? The Salt Lake Church is all of these, yet you trust their words about Joseph Smith. I suggest you consider the source of your information. And the foundation upon which the information your recieve come from. For murder, molestation and criminal ambition it was built upon. I know, I live in Arkansas, in the very area many of the people from the Mountain Medows Massecre came from. I actually know some of their reletives. The RLDS Church has very little to loose. The Utah Church has 22+ Billion reasons per year to loose if they're found out by their members to have lied abouty Smith... My first question to you is where do you want the proof sent to? I can send it here to your blog, Or I can post it upon my blog. Or if you want to send me your email address to jbrianmarshall@gmail.com... I hope I made my point without being to rude? God Bless James Brian Marshall MH,

Correction, Joseph Smith only had one wife. LDS history, RLDS history, as well as the testimonies of thousands of whitnesses testify to this fact.

Would you believe the words of a child molester? Or trust the words of a confirmed criminal? Would you let a murderer preach to you about Christ after he’d just killed somone?

The Salt Lake Church is all of these, yet you trust their words about Joseph Smith.

I suggest you consider the source of your information.
And the foundation upon which the information your recieve come from. For murder, molestation and criminal ambition it was built upon.

I know, I live in Arkansas, in the very area many of the people from the Mountain Medows Massecre came from. I actually know some of their reletives.

The RLDS Church has very little to loose. The Utah Church has 22+ Billion reasons per year to loose if they’re found out by their members to have lied abouty Smith…

My first question to you is where do you want the proof sent to? I can send it here to your blog, Or I can post it upon my blog. Or if you want to send me your email address to jbrianmarshall@gmail.com…

I hope I made my point without being to rude?

God Bless

James Brian Marshall

]]> By: Joseph Smith’s Presidential Platform — Mormon Heretic http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-1954 Joseph Smith’s Presidential Platform — Mormon Heretic Tue, 21 Apr 2009 19:26:51 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-1954 [...] Presidential authority to get involved in state disturbances.  As I mentioned in my Sidney Rigdon post, Van Buren refused to get involved in Missouri because he didn’t feel that was a federal [...] [...] Presidential authority to get involved in state disturbances.  As I mentioned in my Sidney Rigdon post, Van Buren refused to get involved in Missouri because he didn’t feel that was a federal [...]

]]> By: Mormon Heretic http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-1952 Mormon Heretic Tue, 21 Apr 2009 18:01:29 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-1952 James, thanks for the compliments. Joseph had many wives, but certainly not 47,000. I can give you some good references of books if you like (besides this Sidney Rigdon book), and I'm sure some of my new posts will reference the topic again in the future. James, thanks for the compliments. Joseph had many wives, but certainly not 47,000. I can give you some good references of books if you like (besides this Sidney Rigdon book), and I’m sure some of my new posts will reference the topic again in the future.

]]> By: James Brian Marshall http://www.mormonheretic.org/2009/03/27/sidney-joseph-a-strained-friendship-part-4/comment-page-1/#comment-1944 James Brian Marshall Tue, 21 Apr 2009 03:43:36 +0000 http://www.mormonheretic.org/?p=343#comment-1944 Mormon Heritic, My complements to your blog. You obviously have put in a lot of work! I started blogging about a year ago, I love writing, but am an amature compared to yourself. But I was raised to stick with it! So in time I'm sure I'll become a better writer... Which brings me to the point I'm making, which is I never realized how hard blogging can be! It is an art which you've mastered wonderfully! As for responding to the charges Joseph Smith was married to 47,000 wives? I'll respond but I've got to dig for history! For some reason Jesus gifted me with an eye for detail, a passion for history and the will to dig and investigate. And if the History is there I usually find it! And if it is true I publish it! And if the history commonly published it's not true, I publish the fact... So I promise you it will be good stuff! http://rldsincourt.blogspot.com/ Sincerely James Brian Marshall Mormon Heritic,

My complements to your blog. You obviously have put in a lot of work!
I started blogging about a year ago, I love writing, but am an amature compared to yourself. But I was raised to stick with it! So in time I’m sure I’ll become a better writer… Which brings me to the point I’m making, which is I never realized how hard blogging can be! It is an art which you’ve mastered wonderfully!

As for responding to the charges Joseph Smith was married to 47,000 wives? I’ll respond but I’ve got to dig for history! For some reason Jesus gifted me with an eye for detail, a passion for history and the will to dig and investigate. And if the History is there I usually find it! And if it is true I publish it!

And if the history commonly published it’s not true, I publish the fact…

So I promise you it will be good stuff!

http://rldsincourt.blogspot.com/

Sincerely

James Brian Marshall

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